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My my, it's the question of the decade. The holy grail to answering all of life's dilemmas. The answer to your question is inconclusive because you've already decided your stance on the issue. No matter what anyone says or how anyone approaches your question, you will not concede defeat or agree to disagree. You came to pick a fight on a forum of visual kei fans knowing everyone will react, hoping to incite a flame war. Maybe you like having your jimmies rustled. Maybe you just like sowing discord. Maybe I'm completely wrong and your brusque attitude is just masking a wish to truly understand. But in order to avoid pages full of drama with no concrete resolution, I had to lock this topic. I will not allow the users of Monochrome Heaven to fall to the stereotype of the average Japanese weeaboo. We are better than that. But I will answer your question, because I feel compelled to leave you with something to think about no matter what your reasons for coming here was. It is clear to you that visual kei does not offer you what you are looking for. Not all genres of music are for everyone. If you feel that you don't need Japanese men in frilly dresses playing obnoxious power metal, good on you. Continue to listen to whatever floats your boat. But judging visual kei on the merits of a few bands causes you to miss the larger picture. You can never understand a genre by trying out just a few artists. I'd venture to say that you'll never completely understand a genre if you listen to it for as long as you live. What changes is your perception of what's there - how things you've hated you've come to enjoy and vice versa. Growth and maturity is at the heart of listening to music no matter what it is. That is why Monochrome Heaven, the center of visual kei and Japanese rock on the internet, can be home to so many people with completely different music tastes from completely different walks of life. We see and accept each others differences even if we can't understand why others like what they do. But of course you would not know this. I would not expect you to. Now no one's twisted your arm into coming here and sampling what we have. No one is forcing you to listen to the music that we like to listen to. If you don't like visual kei, you don't like visual kei. We won't hold that against you here. If you have come here to open your mind, or at least try something new before you make a decision, you are more than welcome here. But if you have come to this forum to get off over drama stemming from contrived differences in musical opinions, I can tell you that you'll be better off saving face and leaving. I don't take kindly to people that exist to cause problems.

Grieva are doing a good job so far ;D

VK owns and has continued to own. But it seems like if it isn't ~heavy or ~dark then nobody will take an interest, even if the bands are great. Frustrating. PS: Metal fans smell like cabbage.

"There is objectively bad music (in a sense)" - I believe this to be a fairly controversial point to make, but only because people tend to miss the point I'm making, that there are factors that could label music as objectively bad from a composition point of view - it might be that they only rehash a certain chord progression to death, that they copy other bands in a manner that's so blatant and obvious that it makes it impossible to enjoy the music, simply put, the music they make doesn't bring anything even remotely fresh or innovative to the table. I believe that several of bands I consider to be good has some or several of these qualities though, so it doesn't neccessarily make them a bad band in someones opinion, just like I know of several bands with highly innovative and interesting styles that I personally find uninteresting because the music doesn't grab me, there's factors like personal preference in vocals etc. that can't be taken into account since there's no accurate way of measuring such things. Feel free to disagree with me if you want.

em that's the point it's more about entertainment . today's visual kei is more about who is the best entertainer and not who is the better musician/artist . the one who has the most success is the best entertainer. not artist . i mean entertainers have talend too and are needed but just know what is going on. first of all i am a fan of new bands. saying that . although i am not sure at all because i wasn't there lol. it seems old school vk looks have different purpose than today's visual kei looks as ideology. i mean maybe then it was more about looking disobedient or unconventional. today is more about who is the most good looking or acting with sole emphasis on profit and not so much about the shock factor. and that makes old bands have more artistic value. what do you thing about it?? ok they were always crappy bands that coppy each other with same sound but of course the first bands were going to be be respected more just because they were the first/foundational? no matter how crappy.they started the scene. people tend to have a feeling of respect of their roots even if themselves are better.because without them they wouldn't exist. also most important some of them were pioneers and avant-garde and radical at that time .something that now is difficult to exist. i dare to say doesn't exist in visual kei now.

Haha that is undoubtedly one thing you see a lot among owld skewl fans. I like old bands but I have enough sense to know that they're terrible and was an indie no name loser band that broke up after releasing their demo tape for a good reason. Now I like it though and I'll love it till the day I die but I'm not going to lie to myself or trap myself in a bubble thinking that old school VK was the be all end all of VK music. A theory of mine is that, basically Goths love to bitch and moan about how true and gothic they are. I think a lot of old school fans are basically your traditional goth and are drawn to old school VK since it deals more with heavy gothic aesthetics. So combining old school VK with self conscious image centric goths you find yourself with the old school fans parading around that 90s VK was the best and most legit VK ever. Oh jeez, especially among VK fans is the worse. I don't care for Gazette but I have a friend who is incredibly sweet and an amazing person who fucking loves Gazette like no other. If I disliked her simply because she liked a band I'm not fond of, I would be a sad person and missing out on a wonderful friendship. A good example is the Kamijo / Jupiter teams that are forming. Seriously people? It's okay if you don't like Jupiter but other people do or it's okay if people like Kamijo and you don't. Who cares, listen to what you want and TEAM JUPITER! FUCK YAAAL JUPITER 4 LYFE >:U

"Old-school/90's VK wasn't really much better" With so many people parading around old-school superiority, I'd say I'm in the minority with this opinion. As someone who has been in VK for ~10 years and collects tons of old-school stuff, I can certainly say without a bit of doubt that there were a TON of really shitty bands back then. Anyone who would say otherwise is looking through some pretty rose-tinted glasses. That being said, I certainly do miss some of sub-scenes in VK that no longer exist(soft visual/white-kei/proto-oshare) and don't exactly like all of the "sounds" that bands tend to get grouped into nowadays, but I definitely can't say that one era was better or worse than the other as they all have their ups and downs.

Everyone has those opinions on music that either garner condescendent and judgemental sideeyes, or incites flame wars and shitstorms. I'm interested in learning what music opinions you all might have like that. Since popularity and unpopularity are relative and depends on the setting, please also provide a bit of context with your opinions! Also, feel free to discuss the opions that others post! As for my opinions: "VK isn't all bad". "There's some good VK". Now to give you all a bit of context. These opinions are hardly controversial here on MH, but all of the music-heads I consult with outside of MH are adamant about their distaste for VK. Simply put, most of them hate it. So I usually refrain from mentioning anything VK-related in their presence, but IF I DO, I always find myself having to defend this opinion and go the extra mile to show them how credible VK can be. "Dir en grey is still VK": Ok, technically they may not be considered VK and the band may not consider themselves VK anymore. Sure, they've changed their image and have shunned a few traditional VK aesthetics. Sure, they've added harsh, guttural vocals, changed the tuning on their guitars, and have taken on more organic song structures. However, their overall sound is still so battered and deep fried in VK, that it's nearly impossible for me to mentally segregate them from VK as a whole. The fact that VK still has so many Kyo worshipping vocalists doesn't help either. Their influence on VK has been undeniable, so for me to regard them as something completely different now is pretty difficult. I will return later when I think of some more. But for now, that's enough to kick this thread off. What are yours!!??

It was announced today that RIU(ex.メトロノーム) will be releasing a new album titled "東の空、龍が舞う" on 2013/07/28. The album will cost 3000 yen and will be available both at lives and through mail-order (he is looking at the possibility of selling it through Amazon as well). Tracklist: 01 絢爛絵巻 02 一輪の花　Vo YU-DAI(SEX-ANDROID) 03 モダンアナキズム　Vo 団長(NoGoD) 04 浮き世の夢に酔う　Vo Kaya 05 羅刹、門ヲ潜ル 06 纏い付く柵がボクの体温を奪う　Vo Ricky(THE MICRO HEAD 4N'S) 07 月が綺麗だね　Vo 慎一郎(ex.ホタル、ex.Jully) 08 朱色の狂言　Vo 天野鳶丸(ex.グルグル映畫館) 09 涙雨　Vo 福助。(ADAPTER。、THE BEETHOVEN) 10 東の空、龍が舞う　Vo リウ 11 奇想、天外より落つ　Vo 吉川昌利(太平洋ベルト) 12 サーカス　Vo コタニキンヤ.(へーけ) 13 上弦の月　Vo 小林写楽(FLOPPY、GalapagosS) 14 誓いと革命の旗　Vo 清水良行(COSMO-SHIKI、新宿ゲバルト、Divitron)／リウ 15 座興は此れにてお仕舞い　Vo リウ 16 涙色染花

We're a kote kei/industrial gothic metal fusion project we're online based now, forming an actual band is difficult and this is more of a way to gain experience without as much hassle. if you're interested here's our facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/Altermalice.Official?fref=ts https://www.facebook.com/AltermaliceNero contact me through facebook! its nice to have many friendds in the music scene

Hi, Been here for like 2 years, but not active.

Czecho No Republic will be major debut in 2013 autumn, and their new CD (type & title not yet finalized) will be released in 2013 autumn, although details have not yet been announced

Lmao, yes, I totally agree with this one too. There aren't any more crap bands now than there were then. People just tend to always be nostalgic for the ~old days~

It seems like that opinion isn't as unpopular as I thought but I hate VK bands playing Metal. It's not even that I dislike Metal as a genre or influence but the fact that every band does it just destroys most things I like about VK. It takes aways the simplicity and elegance of the genre. The heavy chords eat up the prominent basslines. The dark growls take away that 'vullnerable' feel many VK singers voices have. The SPEED and SKILLZ factor kills the punky garageband-feeling and most of all: The cheesiness and poseritis of visual kei bands isn't properly balanced by the bitter and 'unskilled' post-punk sound anymore. Metal as a music genre is just as cheesy and poseurish as VK as a style and together it's too much pathos. Almost like a fantasy RPG. Also there are more than enough 'real' metal bands out there who do it properly and have singers that actually manage the screaming and growling, there is simply no need for so many VK bands suddenly trying it.

the live was great, and the music is fresh!! Yeah true girugamesh new material influenced by dubstep lol new single is coming this september and new album release this year, no date announced yet

about gazette. i don't hate the people. i am annoyed about the adolescence /weebo fangirlism these fandoms tend to have and the complete lack of interest and knowledge of other bands. i can't follow them in tumblr etc and i don't want to talk to them because a majority tends to posts 231e342312321423 pages of how uruha touched aoi's shoulder ...from a distance... with his eyes... and OMFG the yaoi. and another 33322909-0 pages of fangirlism that i don't care about because i don't find attractive the members. i don't see how i could talk with a person who only like gazette etc and haven't a clue at all about other small bands.or bands that i like. they tend to do that. i mean NOT everyone.they are always exceptions. just saying a lot of people. i prefer lycaon fans etc for example even if i don't listen to them. they seem to know about more bands and have more interesting comments

basically all of my j-rock music since I don't have to focus on lyrics when listening. I typically do a whole discog, ANTHEM is my fave but for harder courses, silence

I don't care about the visuals in VK: I say this is an unpopular opinion because I've been told countless times that it's impossible not to care about the visuals and anyone that says that is lying and on and on. But I don't and I never have. I have some kind of sick attraction to the music itself, but I don't give a flying fuck about the band's appearance and would prefer they didn't look so ridiculous if I had a choice, just so it'd be less embarrassing to point them out to people.

"To the Chaos Inside" is one of my favorite Versailles songs. I really like rose-core ok

1. Number girl 2. うさぎさんの片耳ちょんぎったろか 3. The Stalin 4. あざらし 5. ぐしゃ人間 6. 浅川マキ 7. ミドリ 8. J・A・シーザー 9. Dakuu 堕空 10.Auto-mod (sometimes)

Counting active bands only: 1. B'z 2. サカナクション 3. tacica 4. cinema staff 5. 凛として時雨 6. FoZZtone 7. andymori 8. Base Ball Bear 9. STRAIGHTENER 10. アルカラ

1: X Japan 2: Galneryus 3: Dir en Grey 4: Luna Sea 5: Kuroyume I could only find five most of these are ex-visual kei too lol though most of my non-vkei is classical artists and anime stuff.

lol indeed the name similarities with kyo not only the image .never thought of it before also lycaon guy copies slash i can say more about obvious influences that i see in many jrockers than timeless image.sorry if i am out of subject. most copies i can think are of most jrockers with kiyoharu at some style of his career. except kyo old look. you can see it in guys like byou(screw),singer of lycaon,even in tsuzuku(mejibray) but is not a blatant copy.you just can see clearly the influence.i am sure there are more i can't think right now. and omg if i see one more guy with kiyoharu tattoo. i never understood why so many guys are infatuated so much with kiyoharu more than anyone else. after him is kyo and then hide and maybe hakuei one of most obvious examples is koichi likes hakuei PENICILLIN - RAINBOW pv - YouTube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kie4cmfUero sorry if i am out of subject.and he obviously likes gackt

You can try MergingMoon, they are melodic death metal band, in the past they use male vocal but now they are with female vocal ( yes she can scream) for deathcore, try Death I Am or nocturnal bloodlust (before they are changed to VK) oh I forget to tell HONE YOUR SENSE, Hammerhead Shark, Shatter Silence, Myproof, Sailing before the wind, FEAR FROM THE HATE, NEW BREED, INFECTION, ROACH, Fear, and Loathing in Las Vegas

Axl Rose-like look (aka bandanna with long hair aside + jewelry/crosses/bracelets + shirtless) appreciation post: (since I can't look for certain pics I will post videos AND pics through which you can check these looks) Hiroshi Kyono (The Mad Capsule Markets) - 1993/1994-ish http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UVpC6KLq8Q Kiyoharu Mori (Kuroyume) - 1997 Hakuei (Penicillin) - 1998 (almost close, he did perform without that sleeveless jacket though) Gara (Merry) - 2009 (sort of close to looks above) If you have more similar looks like that (especially from 2000 and so on), then go ahead and reply

^ im gonna punch u

im going to find u and slap u melmo watch out (I miss sugar's sound alot too ; A ; )