Dir en grey

[geist 227]

1 hour ago, Rosner said:

Still, I really like how this one is mixed and my faith for the whole album has been restored. Also, it sounds like a proper album closer: I'm eager to see how the singles fit within the albums continuity. 

I've noticed a dramatic shift in Kaoru's guitar tone. Compare Different Sense with Ningen or the end of Ranunculus. My ear and terminology is not great for these things; but I've read your insights on mixing so I'm curious as to your thoughts. 

 

Quick question: is it that Kaoru has switched to a more mids focused tone? I wanted to know your thoughts on Kaoru's guitar tone if you had any good insight from experience or your studies!

 

Anyone else can answer this, of course.

 

 

[blacktooth 227]

In the DSS era Kaoru was the spearhead of the chugfest guitar tone, so yes he's certainly changed it up. I'd say it's a return to form for him actually.

[Rosner 35]

2 hours ago, ghost said:

The mix on the drums is making me want to thrust my fist into my speakers. It's the same obnoxiously wooden thacking from the previous two singles and I'm concerned that mixing will be the downfall of this album. 

Song wise, I'm actually really digging this. I think it hits a nice balance of commercially catchy and compositionally complex. That piano break with the string synths in the middle also gives me major Rentrer en Soi vibes.

Really? I think it sounds way better than on 'Utafumi' and 'Nigen...'. Of course it's no (lets say...) 'Ænima'-quality drum tone, but I think it sounds way better than on 'Ningen...'. The toms re now bearable and controlled, the bass drum has more body and less click and the snare sounds more 'inside the mix' than before. It's a vast improvement for me. Also, the overall improved sound of the band (less muddy and bass-driven guitars, for example), really help the mix. BUT I agree that the mixing could be this album's downfall: I have the feeling that either a) the whole album was remixed to have cohesion and uniformity or that b) the album is going to be a 'Frankenstein', with each song having a complete different mixing and then an overall mastering that tries to glue 'em all together.  Here's hoping for a... but if it is b, then I'll be punching my speakers too!!!

 

1 hour ago, geist said:

I've noticed a dramatic shift in Kaoru's guitar tone. Compare Different Sense with Ningen or the end of Ranunculus. My ear and terminology is not great for these things; but I've read your insights on mixing so I'm curious as to your thoughts. 

 

Quick question: is it that Kaoru has switched to a more mids focused tone? I wanted to know your thoughts on Kaoru's guitar tone if you had any good insight from experience or your studies!

 

Anyone else can answer this, of course.

The overall rhythm guitar tone in 'Ranunculus' sounds way more satisfactory than on 'Utafumi' and 'Ningen...'. It seems they finally got rid of the 'mid scooped' sound with boosted bass and now they are letting the guitars shine like they are supossed to. Also, the way the bass is mixed really helps: I'm really digging it this way because, while you can perfectly  hear it, it does not have the same mid-range presence as on previous records. It also does not seem to clash with the bass drum, which is the ideal thing for me!

 

Regarding the question, I'm no expert (hope to be some day!), but I'll try to answer. Honestly, I can't tell which part(s) Kaoru is playing, but I just can tell you this: for metal music, when you have wide guitar panning, there's a lot of things you have to do in order to make them sound right. Most of the times (on modern metal, of course), you have the same amp sound double tracked (or even quadtracked) and hard panned: you obtain the sense of stereo wideness thanks to the millisecond differences between each take. So, there's the possibility that both Kaoru and Die used the same amp settings (hell, the same vst or amp modelers surely!) when recording their takes.

 

Also, the guitars used during the recording affect the sound too: maybe they both used the same guitar, maybe not. Keep in mind that going into the studio has a really different approach than playing live for most bands. They could, for example, be endorsed by ESP and play with those guitars live, but on studio they may be recording with, I don't know... Let's say a Les Paul Custom '86 (Boris! Haha) for the rhythm parts, an old Telecaster for the cleans, a Jackson for the solos, some acoustic guitars... Today, I think the band sounds way better live than on studio, which is oddly amusing!

 

There's other possibility: when a band has a guitar player that's clearly best than the other when it comes to rhythm guitar playing, a lot of producers and engineers make that guitar player record every take in order to avoid  slopiness. For me, both Kaoru and Die are great and have different styles, but I would say Die is a tighter player (and you have to consider Kaoru's recent problems with his hand here; what if he wasn't fully healed when recording?) . So, let's say the engineer or producer, or maybe even the band was aware of that, and decided that Die must record all of the rhythm guitar parts. I highly doubt this happened, because the way Die and Kaoru play different things on each side is one of the main traits of the band's music for me (but well, I bet Die could learn Kaoru's lines quickly), but it's also an option -although a far-fetched one considering Kaoru is the leader here-.

 

Then there's one other possible scenario: what if they used different amps for the rhythm guitars? Or different amp/vst/modeler/etc. settings? If that's the case, then they are harder to work with than when the guitars are recorded with the same amps. Of course it's not impossible to make them work, its just harder. For the 'Dum Spiro Spero' sound, it is clear they were using the same settings on each side. I like that guitar sound for that style of music (let's say 'deathcore'), but I think it wouldn't work on a song like 'Ranunculus'. Just check out 'Lotus' single version and then compare it with the album version: the guitars lose a lot brightness. 'Ranunculus' hasn't metal riffs or chugging: it's mainly centered on the 'clean' leads (which, by the way, sound great!) and on the distorted chord progressions in the choruses. There's just one kind of riff at 01:26-01:28 and it sounds like shit (maybe it's intentional).  

Edited September 11, 2018 by Rosner
Typos and bad English!

[blacktooth 227]

I don't know for sure yet, but I'm going to say Die is the one doing the flanger pedal arpeggios. During the chorus I have no idea at all because they're just playing counterpoint to each other. And yeah, that bridge riff at 1:26 is a real non-sequitur.

 

I can't agree with you more on how their lives sound much better than the album recordings these days. Whoever the band's sound engineer is has some serious talent. @Rosner, would you say live sound engineer technique carries over into the studio for recording? 

[Rosner 35]

18 minutes ago, blacktooth said:

I don't know for sure yet, but I'm going to say Die is the one doing the flanger pedal arpeggios. During the chorus I have no idea at all because they're just playing counterpoint to each other. And yeah, that bridge riff at 1:26 is a real non-sequitur.

 

I can't agree with you more on how their lives sound much better than the album recordings these days. Whoever the band's sound engineer is has some serious talent. @Rosner, would you say live sound engineer technique carries over into the studio for recording? 

It would say live sound engineering is a different and even a more complex job! Say you have been working with the band for years: you know what instruments they use, what amps they use, how their setup works, what levels should the vocals have, etc. You also know the songs very well, so you know how to work around the faders. And you also have the backing tracks, which the band uses a lot (synths, additional instruments, samples, etc.). Ok, let's say you have a setup ready for all of that and during rehearses it works marvelously...

 

But then you got to the venue, and you have never ever been in that place. Your setup does not work!!! So you need to improvise, you need to soundcheck with just a couple of songs, you need to do some technical and mathematical stuff that scares me, you need to adjust your settings, you need to accomodate to the venue dimensions and you need to have in mind how the natural reverb and echo of the place affect the sound... AND THAT HAPPENS EVERY SINGLE NIGHT WHEN TOURING! 

 

A studio engineer has a more relaxed job: if he/she records in an studio he/she owns and also uses his/her own equipment for mixing/mastering/etc., then he/she's going to have an easier ride than a live sound engineer. Even when changing studios or gear, there's still less stress than a live engineer, who has to do things hastily and with no room for big mistakes. Also, if the studio engineer has experience and if the band has a big budget (which means they have a lot of time to expend), then surely it's going to be a pleasurable experience.

 

I'm sure the band's current sound engineer for live shows has been working with them for years. He/She knows the band, knows the songs and also knows the venues: if the band played a lot of shows on the same places and he/she was in charge of their sound during those shows, then surely he/she knows what to do beforehand!!!

 

I remembered when Dir en grey came to my country (Argentina) a few years ago (2011): most foreign bands that come here to play and are not big stadium bands have most of the times really bad sounding shows. That's either a) because the promoters for the tours don't have the money to pay for the 'full experiencie', so the bands came to play without their own engineer (leaving the one in the venue in charge, which really is bad idea), or b) the band doesn't have a live engineer or does not bother to tour with the engineer outside of their country or continent. 

 

So far, I can only thing of six small-venue shows that sounded AMAZING during the whole show: Opeth, Katatonia, Gojira, Alcest, Dead Can Dance and of course, Dir en grey. Opeth, Katatonia, Gojira and Alcest toured with their sound engineers: this was confirmed to me by one of the organizers of the show (an acquaintance of mine). Dead Can Dance is a really important and big band for music overall; they played a small venue because people here are very ignorant, but they are really professional, so I'm sure they brought their own egineer. Regarding Dir en grey, I just can only theorize they brought their own engineer too, because it was one of the best shows I've even seen (and heard): perfect sound since the first minute (sadly, the audience was one of the worst I've ever seen in a concert EVER, and while I tried not to pay attention to them, it was a really sad experience...). 

[ghost 2687]

6 hours ago, Rosner said:

Really? I think it sounds way better than on 'Utafumi' and 'Nigen...'. Of course it's no (lets say...) 'Ænima'-quality drum tone, but I think it sounds way better than on 'Ningen...'. The toms re now bearable and controlled, the bass drum has more body and less click and the snare sounds more 'inside the mix' than before. It's a vast improvement for me

I definitely agree with you there. It's better here than on the singles, but it still bothers me on this song. The toms do sound so much better, but they're a bit too prominent in quieter parts and I wish I could hear the guitars more.

 

7 hours ago, Rosner said:

Here's hoping for a... but if it is b, then I'll be punching my speakers too!!!

Yeah, let's hope for a. But, just in case, I'm ready

[Tanishi 598]

What I don't understand is how small bands like DOF and Dimlim can have much better mastering for their records then one of the biggest bands in the scene.
 

13 hours ago, Rosner said:

Dead Can Dance is a really important and big band for music overall; they played a small venue because people here are very ignorant, but they are really professional, so I'm sure they brought their own egineer.

It's interesting seeing this band mentioned here, because they have had an big understated impact on vk influencing Buck-Tick (Atsushi Sakurai), Kisaki,  Luna Sea and the whole darkwave movement in general. 

Edited September 12, 2018 by Tanishi

[Saishu 1589]

1 hour ago, Tanishi said:

What I don't understand is how small bands like DOF and Dimlim can have much better mastering for their records then one of the biggest bands in the scene.
 

I would imagine it has little do with how big or small a band is and everything to do with what they want. Half of Metallica’s albums sound like shit, and they’re one of the biggest bands in the world. 

[Dyingmoments 19]

On 9/11/2018 at 10:16 AM, Dyingmoments said:

Do any of you guys have any of the new mode of dvds? Im in a bind and need a weird favor. Can you measure the length and width of the front of the case for me? Basically I bought the blu rays but Japan discoveries screwed me on the box. I saw a dvd box on yahoo and bought it right away as galaxy broad shop is sold out. So now I need to know if any of my blu rays will fit or if I need to track down the dvds....ugh

 Anybody???

 

Also what is up with the crowd at the macabre show???? Totally lifeless...

[Rosner 35]

19 hours ago, Tanishi said:

It's interesting seeing this band mentioned here, because they have had an big understated impact on vk influencing Buck-Tick (Atsushi Sakurai), Kisaki,  Luna Sea and the whole darkwave movement in general. 

I knew the visual kei movement was originally inspired by darkwave bands, butI didn't knew that Dead Can Dance was such a big influence! To me is one of the best bands in the history of music: they are just out of this world, and their music has a really strange and moving vibe that's hard to replicate. They just announced a new album ('Dionysus') to be released in November! Really excited: 'Anastasis' is one of the best reunion albums ever, so I have really high hopes.

 

[Saishu 1589]

Kyo fucking stop it dude

 

 

[blacktooth 227]

Weird monk/Star Wars prequels alien

[Kelrya 145]

Good lord he looks stupid. Everyone else looks cool though.

[LIDL 692]

48 minutes ago, Saishu said:

Kyo fucking stop it dude

 

 

That is Tilda Swinton cosplaying as Kyo actually

[Dyingmoments 19]

Bro how dare you guys monkshame Kyo. #KYOSBODYKYOSRULES #MONKPRIDE #MONKSEXUAL #MONKPOSITIVITY #ALLMONKSAREBEAUTIFUL 

Edited September 14, 2018 by Dyingmoments

[LIDL 692]

I need scans for avatar, onegai shimasu!

[BlackSwan_86 84]

I LOVE Kyo’s looks of the last times, reminds me of the older Kisou, Vulgar days. 

[LIDL 692]

I'd love for Kyo to put on dreads again actually

[BlackSwan_86 84]

1 hour ago, LIDL said:

I'd love for Kyo to put on dreads again actually

oh yeah, that would be awesome

[nekkichi 6043]

[Tokage 5930]

rare solo image of kyo leaked

[EzraEroguro 174]

There are no words for that shit Kyo is pulling off.

 

I think it looks cool as fuck.

But I gotta ask, why is he going full monk-kei?

[LIDL 692]

Kyo may be onto something here. Monk Kei-Skinhead is the next level of VK to achieve

[nekkichi 6043]

26 minutes ago, EzraEroguro said:

But I gotta ask, why is he going full monk-kei?

t's a good question actually, considering the amount of tacky christian imagery they've been throwing in their PVs for this album.

[Saishu 1589]

Remember when he went bald just for the Lotus PV?