Why all the hearing problems?

[Traxan 148]

After so many decades of drinking and drug problems among western musicians, the myriad of health problems affecting Japanese musicians astounds me. Case in point: hearing. Here's the ones I know, you may know of more:

 

Gacharic Spin dancer Nenne: hearing loss forced her out in 2017, but she has recovered and is now pursuing a non-rock pianist career

Aldious vocalist Re:NO: forced out recently due to her eustacian tube opening, causing deafness, ringing, and dizziness

Roselia keyboardist Akesaka Satomi forced to quit in September after going deaf twice.

 

These are not loud bands. Aldious is the only metal one of the bunch. GS and Roselia have hardly any amps on the stage. And yet one girl after another is losing her hearing. Meanwhile, Lemmy Kilmister never used  protection for his ears and had his hearing right up to the end despite Motorhead's ear-splitting volume (which I experienced a few times).

 

So I have to ask, what the hell is going on in Japan with all these girls losing their hearing?

Edited January 8, 2019 by Traxan

[platy 3018]

Don't forget j-pop queen Ayumi Hamasaki, although she's been in the business for decades which could justify her going deaf but, I dunno. It could just be a made up excuse for them to leave the scene to pursue a family in peace. 

[Seelentau 884]

Didn't that girl from BABYMETAL leave because of hearing issues? Or throat issues, I'm not sure.

 

Anyway, everyone probably knows of Kyo's partial deafness ever since 2000. "R TO THE CORE" from VULGAR is about this, I think.

[Arkady 396]

Loud music tend to damage eardrums, so I don't find it strange at all for people that work in the industry to get problem there.

I bet at least half of those problems are bad tinnitus.

 

 

[colorful人生 2777]

I haven't combed over these thoroughly, but higher incidence of hearing loss might be attributed to ethnicity/genetics*. As for women, my understanding is that men are more prone to hearing loss**. It might seem like it happens more to female Japanese musicians (w/ how clumped these incidents are) , but I'm assuming the heightened coverage is just coincidental (implying that Japanese men might have as much, if not more hearing loss)***. Musicians, especially live performers, are more prone to hearing loss.****

 

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.3109/03005369609076781

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22124888

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/44568755_Hereditary_hearing_loss_and_deafness_genes_in_Japan

 

Also, there are a lot of things that can contribute to hearing loss and dizziness. Just throwing ideas around.

 

* I mean genetics obviously plays a role in hearing loss. I'm implying here that maybe Japanese or East Asians are more susceptible.

** https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9746707

     https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1808869415313483

Whether it be hearing loss or tinnitus, it's a bit more complicated than what I initially thought. I was thinking of the 60% v. 40% finding by the  CDC.

*** @nekkichi brings up a point I completely glossed over here:

8 hours ago, nekkichi said:

...it's the western culture of never disclosing actual issues and putting up a fake smile and a statement of gratitude for stans for supporting the 200+ date tours.

 

...doesn't really affect hearing, but every time you hear about sudden liver transplants and "mental maintenance breaks" that's the roundabout way to cover up an addiction.

Collectivist cultures like Japan's tend to misdiagnose or shove under the rug health problems in lieu of getting them actually treated. I think that further compounds the hearing loss diagnoses issue. What's likely is that the musicians probably have a fuck-ton of problems but don't get them treated so they don't become an "inconvenience". (This mentality generally exists w/ everyone but feels more severe given cultural norms)

****

8 hours ago, nekkichi said:

https://www.aarp.org/health/conditions-treatments/info-2018/musicians-hearing-loss.html

 

Edited January 9, 2019 by colorfuljinsei

[Traxan 148]

3 hours ago, platy said:

Don't forget j-pop queen Ayumi Hamasaki, although she's been in the business for decades which could justify her going deaf but, I dunno. It could just be a made up excuse for them to leave the scene to pursue a family in peace. 

Ayu was stupid. She had a hearing/ear infection and was TOLD to cancel her tour and she didn't do it. That injury was self-inflicted.

 

2 hours ago, Arkady said:

Loud music tend to damage eardrums, so I don't find it strange at all for people that work in the industry to get problem there.

I bet at least half of those problems are bad tinnitus.

First, they wear ear monitors which block the noise. And again, we're not talking Motorhead. Look at Tomo's setup:

 

 

A half stack. I know people who practice on that.

 

Same deal with Roselia I just can't find an image. And the girl who went deaf is the keyboardist, whose position was behind the amp.

 

It just goes along with a disturbing trend I've seen in Japan with poor health in women in the primes of their lives. Armmy, Rami, Yui, all these deafnesses. Something just isn't right.

[Traxan 148]

1 hour ago, colorfuljinsei said:

I haven't combed over these thoroughly, but higher incidence of hearing loss might be attributed to ethnicity/genetics. As for women, my understanding is that men are more prone to hearing loss (needs citation). It might seem like it happens more to female Japanese musicians (w/ how clumped these incidents are) , but I'm assuming the heightened coverage is just coincidental (implying that Japanese men might have as much, if not more hearing loss). Musicians, especially live performers, are more prone to hearing loss. (needs citation)

 

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.3109/03005369609076781

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22124888

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/44568755_Hereditary_hearing_loss_and_deafness_genes_in_Japan

 

Also, there are a lot of things that can contribute to hearing loss and dizziness. Just throwing ideas around.

Well that makes the most sense.

[nekkichi 6043]

https://www.aarp.org/health/conditions-treatments/info-2018/musicians-hearing-loss.html

 

it's not specific to Japanese artists (who in addition are likely living in the constant state of burnout unless their family funds payroll their career), it's the western culture of never disclosing actual issues and putting up a fake smile and a statement of gratitude for stans for supporting the 200+ date tours.

 

18 hours ago, Traxan said:

After so many decades of drinking and drug problems among western musicians

doesn't really affect hearing, but every time you hear about sudden liver transplants and "mental maintenance breaks" that's the roundabout way to cover up an addiction.

[saishuu 3220]

20 hours ago, colorfuljinsei said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22124888

A PubMed link? In MH? where am I

[Traxan 148]

5 hours ago, nekkichi said:

https://www.aarp.org/health/conditions-treatments/info-2018/musicians-hearing-loss.html

 

it's not specific to Japanese artists (who in addition are likely living in the constant state of burnout unless their family funds payroll their career), it's the western culture of never disclosing actual issues and putting up a fake smile and a statement of gratitude for stans for supporting the 200+ date tours.

I don't disagree, just note that those are older musicians who have endured years of abuse. Re:No is 32 and was with Aldious 6 years. The Roselia keyboardist whose name escapes me is 30 and was with the band two years, and I believe Nenne was 18 and with GS 2 years. Not exactly the kind of mileage of James Hetfield or Pete Townshend.

[patientZERO 1066]

On 1/8/2019 at 4:50 PM, Seelentau said:

Didn't that girl from BABYMETAL leave because of hearing issues? Or throat issues, I'm not sure.

 

Anyway, everyone probably knows of Kyo's partial deafness ever since 2000. "R TO THE CORE" from VULGAR is about this, I think.

I'm pretty sure Yui left BABYMETAL because of the rigorous touring schedule taking a toll on her health, but didn't state whether it was hearing or her throat. Given that she states she's pursuing a solo career, I don't think it would be the latter, but we never know for sure with these kinds of things.

[LIDL 692]

Hearing issues are common with musicians since they play loud music live for over and over again. 

Honestly, I attended a metal/rock show one time and I got to stood on the front row and exposed to these high frequency noises and I did get temporary deafness for a day after that. Imagine getting that but almost daily. 

[nekkichi 6043]

8 hours ago, Traxan said:

I don't disagree, just note that those are older musicians who have endured years of abuse. Re:No is 32 and was with Aldious 6 years. The Roselia keyboardist whose name escapes me is 30 and was with the band two years, and I believe Nenne was 18 and with GS 2 years. Not exactly the kind of mileage of James Hetfield or Pete Townshend.

Grimes was cancelling shows at 24 (? - sources differ), and she barely tours since but I'm not sure if that's her dumb pill-addicted head doing stupid shit to blame, or an actual byproduct of being a concert performing artistè:

Quote

Grimes: The 26-year-old indie-pop rocker canceled her entire European tour* two years ago due to a case of tinnitus. She even reports she once pressed her ears against the speakers at a concert by her favorite band, Animal Collective.

(* four dates is an "entire tour".)

 

a RHCP member is mentioned here during a nirvana coupling tour so that makes him like age 3 or so when the issues developed:

 

 http://www.thecavanproject.com/musicians-hearing-loss/

 

here's what miracle of google brought out too:

Quote

 

There are a plethora of ways to prevent hearing loss, from wearing earplugs and insert-receivers to simply just making sure you don't play too loud. Not to say music shouldn't be played loud, but perhaps not to the point that it causes permanent damage. Sound technicians only turn the music up as loud as the musicians want, so it's ultimately in their hands to rock our socks off without knocking out our eardrums as well as their own.

Ear, nose and throat specialist, Dr. Brian Hands says that the number one mistake younger artists make is amping up the volume of their shows. "'Louder is better.' It's all part of this process that takes place at a large rock concert and people like that sound," says Hands. "But that sound is going to hurt your ears; it causes pain, nausea in low frequency sounds and then it silently destroys your hearing."

Hands says that if a concert is at a level of 105 to 120 decibels and you're there for multiple hours, there is a a risk of permanent hearing loss. To put that into perspective, normal conversations usually clock in at 78 to 80 decibels while a passing jetplane is about 110 to 120 decibels, so a concert can be the equivalent of a jetplane zipping back and fourth above you for hours.

On top of that, musicians should get their hearing checked on a frequent basis. A number of organizations have been established around the world now to help assist with hearing tests and general education about hearing loss including H.E.A.R. (Hearing Education and Awareness for Rockers) (and the Musicians' Clinics of Canada.

As Grimes herself advises on indie smash "Oblivion," "Girl you know you gotta watch your health."

 

https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2012/11/01/music-hearing-loss-tinnitus-grimes_n_2059122.html

Edited January 10, 2019 by nekkichi

[Traxan 148]

Ok, you win. Point made and taken.

[nekkichi 6043]

15 hours ago, Traxan said:

Ok, you win. Point made and taken.

there's another angle to why this is reported so often in public (as opposed to the Japanese habit of shunning issues - i.e. in visual kei you'll have apparent suicides disguised as accidents or death/retirement issues never explained in public because the members themselves live relatively private lives) - the bands you're pretty much posting on here exclusively have disturbed, creepy male fans;

 

"hearing issues" is a respectable opt-out of a toxic scene that doesn't seem really removed from general idol mess that literally came through this week again:

 

https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/international/8493058/j-pop-girl-group-ngt48-apologizes-discussing-assault-yamaguchi-maho

 

 

I don't think ramen-fed mouthbreathers have a normal human response to their metal-waifus wanting to have kids and healthy families.

[saiko 429]

1 hour ago, nekkichi said:

there's another angle to why this is reported so often in public (as opposed to the Japanese habit of shunning issues - i.e. in visual kei you'll have apparent suicides disguised as accidents or death/retirement issues never explained in public because the members themselves live relatively private lives) - the bands you're pretty much posting on here exclusively have disturbed, creepy male fans;

 

"hearing issues" is a respectable opt-out of a toxic scene that doesn't seem really removed from general idol mess that literally came through this week again:

 

https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/international/8493058/j-pop-girl-group-ngt48-apologizes-discussing-assault-yamaguchi-maho

 

 

I don't think ramen-fed mouthbreathers have a normal human response to their metal-waifus wanting to have kids and healthy families.

So, is this girl actually apologizing for making public that someone tried to assault her? Am I reading right? ... Like Japanese media making a victimizer off the victim? 

 

[nekkichi 6043]

59 minutes ago, saiko said:

So, is this girl actually apologizing for making public that someone tried to assault her? Am I reading right? ... Like Japanese media making a victimizer off the victim?

I'm not familiar with the japanese sources on her situation, but this so far is the tea, yes.

[saiko 429]

OMG, what is the media pretending? To her not get shocked and try to seek for help, at least some cataharsis, only to be a pretty doll? I'm puking...

Japan's still very far from the West in this themes...

[Traxan 148]

4 hours ago, nekkichi said:

I'm not familiar with the japanese sources on her situation, but this so far is the tea, yes.

I saw this on NHK World last night. I think what happened is she said something on Twitter about how a month had passed and nothing had been done and the police hadn't investigated or anything. That caused a stir, and that's what caused the apology. I'll check NHK Newsline to see if they run it again, but a day later it's doubtful.

 

7 hours ago, nekkichi said:

there's another angle to why this is reported so often in public (as opposed to the Japanese habit of shunning issues - i.e. in visual kei you'll have apparent suicides disguised as accidents or death/retirement issues never explained in public because the members themselves live relatively private lives) - the bands you're pretty much posting on here exclusively have disturbed, creepy male fans;

 

"hearing issues" is a respectable opt-out of a toxic scene that doesn't seem really removed from general idol mess that literally came through this week again:

This is true. Armmy's departure from Gacharic Spin was explained as health problems but she started her Takaeita project within a few months. Also there are rumors she did not get along with Hana, which pretty much ends you because she is BFFs with Koga who is the boss. Plus, no cause of death has ever been disclosed, but suicide has been floated more than once.

 

In Rami's case, that was the theory on JMF, that she cited health when she was actually driven out, but on returning has been to multiple Aldious shows and photographed with the other girls. IIRC, she made a tweet on her return that she didn't want to hear people say come back to Aldious (by this point it was obvious Re:No stunk at the job), that Re:No was the singer and she didn't want her old job back. And Re:No thanked her.

 

Of course, with Re:No out, Rami's Twitter feed is full of people begging her to return to Aldious. But I don't believe it will happen.

[Traxan 148]

Update on the idol case, if anyone cares.

 

http://aramajapan.com/news/maho-yamaguchi-apologizes-again-management-finally-release-statement-on-her-assault/94545/

[nekkichi 6043]

3 hours ago, Traxan said:

Update on the idol case, if anyone cares.

 

http://aramajapan.com/news/maho-yamaguchi-apologizes-again-management-finally-release-statement-on-her-assault/94545/

to anyone wondering if it's worth reading, the attached management statement is fucked up on several layers and everything about this incident and the performers treatment is infuriating

[platy 3018]

The idol industry disgusts me in so many ways. How there's a constant influx of people willingly going into it is baffling. 

[Traxan 148]

“There are many mentally unwell girls in AKB48” claims ex-member of Japan’s top idol singer group

https://soranews24.com/2019/01/16/there-are-many-mentally-unwell-girls-in-akb48-claims-ex-member-of-japans-top-idol-singer-group/

[platy 3018]

1 hour ago, Traxan said:

“There are many mentally unwell girls in AKB48” claims ex-member of Japan’s top idol singer group

https://soranews24.com/2019/01/16/there-are-many-mentally-unwell-girls-in-akb48-claims-ex-member-of-japans-top-idol-singer-group/

Water is wet.

 

I wonder what kind of punishment awaits for someone who makes a statement like that. 

[LIDL 692]

I am not surprised at the victim blaming. This is really sad reality in Japan. They also do the same to people who struggle with depression. Very frowned upon. They'd take them as an outcast or as if they are people with dangerous disease.

I guess it is back again to Japanese's  way of life and the social caste stuffs. There were these saying in Japanese that said, "出る釘は打たれる" (nails that sticks out will be hammered down) , and でるくいがうたれる (don't rock the boat), which both are pretty much have the same intention, and that is what happen here.

Edited January 16, 2019 by LIDL