Good and Bad things about Japan?

[Biopanda 2675]

I didn't know that pimping was that hard of work

It's a hard job, but someone has to do it ;3

[JukaForever 758]

That's not a Japanese-only thing though. Just look at Toddlers & Tiaras and/or the whole child beauty pageant scene as a whole.

in manga and anime, i think it is unique

[Biopanda 2675]

in manga and anime, i think it is unique

Well yeah... because manga and anime is only from Japan? There's plenty of drawn content from people all over the world because people are perverts no matter their country of origin :v

[nekkichi 6042]

also the sexualization of young girls like less than 10 yrs old

I'm not sure what you mean here tbh, considering some south east asian countries have been long known as hubs employing tweens in sex trade.

 

japan seems fairly puritan, outside of lolicon subculture, which hardly formalizes into irl offense.

[Original Saku 1593]

I'm not sure what you mean here tbh, considering some south east asian countries have been long known as hubs employing tweens in sex trade.

 

japan seems fairly puritan, outside of lolicon subculture, which hardly formalizes into irl offense.

Exactly. there is nothing wrong with liking the lolicon subculture, no matter what anybody says. unless it leads into irl offenses which almost never is the case.

[JukaForever 758]

Nah, those mangas and stuff are available on comicstands and such, anime is buyable. It is freely available, they wouldn't be allowed in us/can or at least face heavy restriction. I will post a link of a vid discussing it if I can find it.

[Biopanda 2675]

Nah, those mangas and stuff are available on comicstands and such, anime is buyable. It is freely available, they wouldn't be allowed in us/can or at least face heavy restriction. I will post a link of a vid discussing it if I can find it.

I actually was just reading something about this on another forum and that sort of stuff is actually legal in most of the US(and a bunch of other countries, I believe?). Sure, you won't be hoping over to the local bookstore to buy to loli mags, but that's what the internet is for, I suppose. I guess their being lax about it could be seen as a bit of a problem though, but that's what you get when you sexually repress a whole culture like 'Murrica did :'D

[JukaForever 758]

Found it:

 

 

also his channel has quite a lot of discussion of things about Japan, some bad stuff, some good but do take note that it is from a point of view of an Australian married to a Japanese woman living in a small prefecture.

 

 

I actually was just reading something about this on another forum and that sort of stuff is actually legal in most of the US(and a bunch of other countries, I believe?). Sure, you won't be hoping over to the local bookstore to buy to loli mags, but that's what the internet is for, I suppose. I guess their being lax about it could be seen as a bit of a problem though, but that's what you get when you sexually repress a whole culture like 'Murrica did :'D

 

I would suppress the hell out of sexual urges on a minor....unless it can be a proven mental illness in which case it should try to be treated.

[Biopanda 2675]

Found it:

 

 

also his channel has quite a lot of discussion of things about Japan, some bad stuff, some good but do take note that it is from a point of view of an Australian married to a Japanese woman living in a small prefecture.

 

 

 

I would suppress the hell out of sexual urges on a minor....unless it can be a proven mental illness in which case it should try to be treated.

They were repressing all sexuality though, not just minor-oriented sexuality, with the censorship laws that America pushed onto them post-WW2. That is probably one of the big reasons that hentai exists in the first place, since it can skirt around the censorship laws a bit. Also the censorship is the whole reason that tentacle porn exists... so it was America that made Japan so fucking weird

[JukaForever 758]

I don't think being sexual repression justifies sexualizing minors though.

[Biopanda 2675]

I don't think being sexual repression justifies sexualizing minors though.

I assume that part is just a deeply-rooted cultural thing? Japan was pretty closed off to the rest of the world for a really long time and, given their current laws on age-of-consent, that was a pretty normal thing to do back then. Not saying that makes it okay, but when you've got a culture that for thousands of years it's just a normal part of life until one day some foreigners come knocking about and are like "hey guys that's not cool" then I guess old habits die hard?

[Yuuze 49]

I don't think being sexual repression justifies sexualizing minors though.

Say, ever heard of this novel called Lolita? Pretty famous thing? Deals with this subject in an entirely non-Japanese context?

[JukaForever 758]

Are you sure it is famous?

[Biopanda 2675]

Are you sure it is famous?

"Lolita is included on Time's List of the 100 Best Novels in the English language from 1923 to 2005. It is fourth on the Modern Library's 1998 list of the 100 Best Novels of the 20th century. It was also included in the 100 Best Books of All Time, compiled in 2002 by the Norwegian Book Club."

 

Apparently.

[JukaForever 758]

Ok so it is about as famous as it get for people that actually reads books. What about it? I have heard about it myself but never read it.

[Yuuze 49]

Ok so it is about as famous as it get for people that actually reads books. What about it? I have heard about it myself but never read it.

It's about sexualisation of a minor.

 

So, perhaps this tradition of sexualising minors is not unique to Japan. Child pornography was legal in large parts of the world until the 1980's, and banning it has not exactly decreased the practical problem of child abuse - if anything there's indication of an inverse correlation that moralist legislation and repression of access to pornography increases the frequency of actual abuses.

[JukaForever 758]

Sexualizing of minors and child abuse is not the same thing. One is for market, the other is action on a minor.

So what if it took until the 1980s to ban child pornography? In the end, it is rightfully banned. Laws takes a long time to properly develope. It doesn't matter if it was ok back then, what matters is that the majority of society have it ingrained in their heads that what is wrong is justifiably wrong. Similar issues can be found every where whether it be homophobia, racial inequality, or gender fairness etc. In many countries, laws are yet to be developed that address this issue. It is horrifyong to know that there is public assault on gays in Jamaica, sexual mobs on women in the public in Egypt, raping as a form of punishment in India. All the while the attackers aren't accounted for or they simply get a pass because it is something that is still seen as ok societal wise.

Please don't just mention a book and not actually use that oppurtunity to justify whatever point it is you are trying to make. It makes me think you haven't read the book yourself.

[Yuuze 49]

Sexualizing of minors and child abuse is not the same thing. One is for market, the other is action on a minor.

So what if it took until the 1980s to ban child pornography? In the end, it is rightfully banned. Laws takes a long time to properly develope. It doesn't matter if it was ok back then, what matters is that the majority of society have it ingrained in their heads that what is wrong is justifiably wrong. Similar issues can be found every where whether it be homophobia, racial inequality, or gender fairness etc. In many countries, laws are yet to be developed that address this issue. It is horrifyong to know that there is public assault on gays in Jamaica, sexual mobs on women in the public in Egypt, raping as a form of punishment in India. All the while the attackers aren't accounted for or they simply get a pass because it is something that is still seen as ok societal wise.

Please don't just mention a book and not actually use that oppurtunity to justify whatever point it is you are trying to make. It makes me think you haven't read the book yourself.

 

The point is that "banning cp" is an act that is not done out of concern for children (it does not decrease child abuse [http://bigthink.com/against-the-new-taboo/testing-our-moral-convictions-decriminalising-child-porn-to-reduce-child-crime]) but because it is a pointless moralist and self-righteous act that stems from the reason that "bad things ought to be illegal". It needs to be pointed out that producing child porn was illegal even prior to banning the pornography (because it actually involves children being abused).

 

Why should then animated or fictional pornography be banned? The argument in favour of the banning of real CP is typically the fact that some child was abused at some point in the process of production (in turn, the repression gives rise to dark secretive groupings of rapists who produce porn for their own familiar use, thus the rise of these serial-rapist rings). But with fictional accounts, no child was ever harmed; why should that be illegal? There is no justification, no reason, except a worthless moral outcry because one individual finds something deplorable and morally repugnant.

 

The book I mentioned because the plot revolves around a man who has an infatuation with a 12 year old girl, and this is part of the Western literature's commonly praised Canon (I have not read it - I do not like books like this, I have no interest in Nabokov). I mention the book because it deals with sexualisation of a minor. What's there to understand? Sexualisation of minors is rife across the world. It is not unique to Japan. Animated/comic pornography results - as has already been mentioned in this thread - partially from post-war puritanical censorship laws enforced by the American occupation government on Japan, combined with the particular comic (manga) tradition - but the content therein is not unique, and sexualisation of minors is everpresent the world over in one shape or another, no matter how you would like to change that.

[JukaForever 758]

For the love of god, paraphrase the point of the article you are using as well as its arguments.

 

Your 1st paragraph makes me think you are in the defense of allowing child pornography. That is a first for me to see as I have yet to encounter anybody that actually does defend it. I do agree that banning child pornography is based on morals (not sure about self-righteousness though) as most laws are based on collective morals. However the moral is to not harm children and protect them from sexual preds. I don't how fucking/sexualizing a child is ok for people at all. 

 

In terms of animation, good point in that no harm done on a child. Obviously you can't stop anybody's thoughts but still, I don't how fucking/sexualizing a child is ok for people at all. 

 

On your last paragraph, if it deals with a persons infatuation of minor, then is the book delving on the psyche of the man with the infatuation or is it a sexualization of a minor? The 2 are different mind you, one is explaining why the man finds sexual urges on a minor and the other is making a child fuckable.

[The Bread Wolf 231]

Hey, hold on now. Calm yer tits, everyone. 

 

 

In terms of animation, good point in that no harm done on a child. Obviously you can't stop anybody's thoughts but still, I don't how fucking/sexualizing a child is ok for people at all.

Okay now, I don't understand people with scat fetish or sweat fetish or even fucking foot fetish, or even a fetish for god damn my little ponies. But it's not my place to say what is an alright form of sexuality and what is fucked up. Generally, any fetish is fucked up, really. You shouldn't have any. But who of us doesn't? My opinion is that ANYTHING is fine as long as it's fiction.

 

Are you moralizing furry fetishist as well? Because god damn I'd find it sick to fuck a dog. Yet there's furry porn and I don't think it's wrong at all. I don't think it "sexualizes" animals. I don't think it increases the amount of zoophiles out there. If someone can suppress their sexual frustration towards little girls by reading lolicon, hell, let him keep it! I'd rather have creepy guys read fictional child porn than search for more "alive" material, like other people's kids on a beach photos, or worse, start acting upon their urges. That's what I imagine would happen in Japan if lolicon was banned. People wouldn't be just like "Oh well now I realize what I was doing wrong all along. I now lack a fetish for little girls. Praise Jesus." Do you see that happen? Really? Do you?

 

Yes, I think child molesters and confined paedophile should be fucking castrated, but unless they've done something to a child, or at least seriously considered doing something to a child, I've nothing against them and neither should you. Different people like different things and have different urges. A good person is determined by knowing which of them is okay to act upon. 

[Zeus 7997]

Can you bring this back to the topic at hand? Moral outrage at cheese pizza is one thing. Talking about the good and bad points about Japan (however uninformed we may be) is another.

[The Bread Wolf 231]

BAD THING IS THAT JAPANESE PEOPLE HUNT WHALES WHEN GREENPEACE HAS TOLD THEM A BAZILLION TIMES TO STOP THAT.

 

Seriously. Whales. Dolphins. Stop eating them, Japs. 

[Biopanda 2675]

Maybe if whales would stop being so damn tasty, they wouldn't have to be hunted!

[JukaForever 758]

Hey, hold on now. Calm yer tits, everyone. 

 

 

Okay now, I don't understand people with scat fetish or sweat fetish or even fucking foot fetish, or even a fetish for god damn my little ponies. But it's not my place to say what is an alright form of sexuality and what is fucked up. Generally, any fetish is fucked up, really. You shouldn't have any. But who of us doesn't? My opinion is that ANYTHING is fine as long as it's fiction.

 

Are you moralizing furry fetishist as well? Because god damn I'd find it sick to fuck a dog. Yet there's furry porn and I don't think it's wrong at all. I don't think it "sexualizes" animals. I don't think it increases the amount of zoophiles out there. If someone can suppress their sexual frustration towards little girls by reading lolicon, hell, let him keep it! I'd rather have creepy guys read fictional child porn than search for more "alive" material, like other people's kids on a beach photos, or worse, start acting upon their urges. That's what I imagine would happen in Japan if lolicon was banned. People wouldn't be just like "Oh well now I realize what I was doing wrong all along. I now lack a fetish for little girls. Praise Jesus." Do you see that happen? Really? Do you?

 

Yes, I think child molesters and confined paedophile should be fucking castrated, but unless they've done something to a child, or at least seriously considered doing something to a child, I've nothing against them and neither should you. Different people like different things and have different urges. A good person is determined by knowing which of them is okay to act upon.

 

The thing is my OP wasn't even on the topic of child porn, it was the sexualization of minors in media. I guess when I posted a video with a title of "Child Pornography" and not actually watched/listened to the contents, you'd think it was about child porn. 

 

I don't know anything about furries, it is wierd but at least it has actual sex organs made for fucking....assuming the animal is fully matured though. I have mentioned this already, porn and sexualizing, are not the same thing in my books. Even if I were to watch 2 people fucking, doesn't mean I have the urge to fuck every time I see a woman. I am also not christian, so Jesus has no meaning to me... I already know I can't change a person even if there is a law against what they love. It's one of the reasons why the drug business thrives even though people know it isn't so good for them. Also, I don't know what lolicon is. I only ever heard of lolita which I though was playing dress-up with clothing from a different era. IDK.

 

On your last paragraph, I didn't say I have something against them, heck you want to castrate them. I just don't like the availability of sexualized minors in media in Japan compared to NA. Does that say anything about me having something against them?

 

Whaling was part of a culture from my understanding. That there is a good point in bringing up culture and how you can't change it so quick.

[hiroki 5521]

Well.. the whaling issue is incredibly complex. To me, citing cultural arguments for whaling or ethical arguments against whaling do nothing but distract from the task of reaching some sort of solution. On one hand culture is too often used as an excuse to justify undesirable practices (e.g. "hey it's the culture here to get the ladies in our office to open doors and pour coffee, ya know?") or as a smokescreen to deflect criticism against said practices; on the other hand the "animal rights" argument against whaling is nothing but pure hypocrisy because I don't even wanna know the full list of atrocities on animals in these very countries lobbying for a whaling ban, only that no one has ever called them out for it.

 

Anyway, for me:

 

Good things about Japan:

- Transport efficiency. Living in Japan made me realize how ridiculously slow the trains in my country run. When the shinkansen in Japan breaks down it's reported on national news - if the same thing happens here I'm afraid there's no time for the news to cover anything else.

- Service. Service standards in Japan are unbeatable. I wish my local fishmonger can stop looking as if I murdered his daughter whenever I go down to the market.

- Konbini (convenience stores).

- Weather. This is debatable, but I live in a tropical country with almost 100% humidity and temperatures of around 32C all year round, so..

- The sense of "distance" between unfamiliar people. Again, highly debatable point - I guess it may be "good" or "bad" depending on your personality and outlook. I'm just someone who prefers others (especially strangers) to respect my privacy and personal space, and not get too enthusiastic with the awkward questions. Obviously, this can come across as "cold" to other people.

 

 

Bad things:

- Work culture. I'll never ever want to work in Japan, 'nuff said. Especially not as a salaryman in a Japanese SME.

- Language. Ok this is tricky because I really love the Japanese language. But I've always felt that the surprisingly low levels of fluency with English in Japan is somewhat debilitating for the native Japanese in terms of how many "doors" not knowing English closes. Not just commercially, but culturally as well. The government has always tried to improve the situation but nothing seems to work..

 

There are probably a few more "bad" things about Japan that I can't recall offhand.