Emotion in music/vocals

[fitear1590 2414]

This has something that I've thought about for a while now.

I'll use Versailles as an example.

They're one of my favorite Japanese bands, but they frequently get this bad rap for "having no emotion" in their music or even in Kamijo's vocals. The whole symphonic power metal thing isn't my favorite genre, but for some reason, Versailles' stuff just "clicks" with me. A lot of the riffs/solos give me chills. Many of their songs just "move" me. (Not to tears though, haha)

So what is emotion in music? It seems like for the people who knock Versailles for this supposed lack of emotion, they see a sort of inverse relationship between technical skill and emotion. (AKA, more technical skill = less emotion) But I don't think they're so mutually exclusive. For me, Versailles is a good example of technicality AND emotion. I can be in awe of their skill, but also love the music. For instance, technical death metal doesn't do much for me. Yeah, it's interesting to hear and it makes you go "wow, they can play that?" But at the end of the day, I don't really care about this type of music. At the same time, I don't give care if you're on the ground, writhing with your guitar, playing some sloppy riff that is oh so emotional.

How about vocals? Returning to the Versailles example, I'd say Kamijo has increased his technical vocal talent since Lareine, quite a bit. If you watch the lives, he's quite into it. He sings at the top of lungs. He's not just standing in front of the mic boredly. But time and time again, some say he supposedly has no emotion. Let's look at Malice Mizer now. Quite a few people say Tetsu (the short-lived first vocalist) was the best, because of his strong emotion. I personally find him almost unlistenable. I don't think you could convince me otherwise. I like 'lafflesia' from him and that's it. For me, his "strong emotion" just equals wailing into the mic. But I understand his style is liked/preferred by a lot of people, over the two more technically skilled vocalists of MM.

So basically...

What does emotion in music and vocals mean to you?

To what extent do you find this emotion to be subjective?

Let's have an intelligent discussion. What do you guys think?

I swear, if you guys kill this thread with 4chanisms and gifs, I'll choke a bitch.

(Btw, this is totally open to all bands/music. Versailles was just my example)

[LIDL 692]

when singers just sing for the sake of singing and blandly/emotionless,

well, not much listeners can get from lyrics he/she sang.

but when emotions are involved,

there will be many listeners that can relate to the song more.

Good/outstanding voice isn't all.

[Nyasagi 259]

Emotions are very important to me, not only in music, but in lyrics too. Of course, I like many bands which don't sound emotional, but I love the emotional ones the most, like Nega or UnsraW (I don't know if their lyrics are emotional, but Nega's are). I like listening to their music when I'm feeling upset, it's a kind of therapy for me. I need to feel even more depressed for a while to get over it quicker.

When I listen just to the music, I don't try to think about any further meaning, but I do think about it when I read the lyrics. It's like with poems, everyone interprets them in their own, personal way and sometimes I feel like I know what the lyrics are about, but it doesn't mean I'm completely right. Who knows what the lyricist meant, what he was thinking about? That's why I don't like metaphors and complicated stuff. Straightforwardness is something I can understand easily.

(I wish I could say more, but I'm not a native English speaker and it's almost 5am, so I'm in a brainless stare)

[Senedjem 510]

I have this thing for vocalists that sound like they're trying really hard to sing without bursting into tears.

[fitear1590 2414]

Interesting guys.

I like hearing your opinions. Keep em coming.

Also, post some example links, if you want. Particularly Senedjem. Sounds intriguing.

[Senedjem 510]

Also, post some example links, if you want. Particularly Senedjem. Sounds intriguing.

I was thinking along the lines of munimuni :V

[Miasma 162]

I agree with basically everything Fitear stated. Sometimes being a talented vocalist really isn't enough, emotion is need if you want to project your voice to higher levels. One thing I see with many vocalists is they simply lack any form of emotion while they sing. One such vocalist that comes to mind whenever I think about this is Satoshi (girugamesh). Personally, I think the guy has a great voice, but I never feel anything whenever I hear him.

There's a handful of vocalists that just plain give me the chills whenever I listen to them, it's a good thing though.

, Rita (E'm~grief~), Satsuki (RENTRER EN SOI), and (I agree that he isn't the greatest vocalist, but there's a certain charm to his voice, that and he conveys a lot of emotion in this particular song)

.

[ronluna 17]

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this song expresses sad emotion
usually a band expresses their emotions using their experiences and inspirations
this 44MAGNUM/Michael Monroe fan usually creates deep lyrics
accompanied by Satoshi Hirose fan in creating music
those emotions are being spread to the fans and listeners
VOICE/VOCAL+MUSIC
it depends on the song in which they perform
but an emotional song usually starts slowly then it becomes faster like this:

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[LIDL 692]

gonna give easiest examples:

this one sang with fullest emotions, can you feel it?

while this one, suppose to be good song, but the bland vocal make it sounded meh,

^ i mean really, that's too bad.

[Mr Bacon 106]

A lot of songs would be worthless without emotion on the vocals.

This particular song's not just about the vocals though, especially the guitars can really convey that feeling as well. But in the chorus, both Gokimi and Linda's vocals are full of it.

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[JRD 5156]

Emotions mean alot to me, i want to feel waht the singer is feeling.

For me almost all the Panic Channel songs including the soft rock of the Pop Rock side have alot of emotion. Which is why they're my fave band.

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[ramrod 108]

Havent read anything, but Satsuki and Kyo are the masters at emotional singing.

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[Senedjem 510]

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Well, they make me feel emotional anyway D:

[flikflak 41]

I think what is emotionnal in music in highly subjective.

It will depend on one's past experiences, likes and dislikes, and one's state of mind at a given time. There's some time in a day or in one's life where a song will be more fitting.

And then there's the vocals and lyrics. As was said some posts before a good vocalist does not necessarily convey emotions, but sometimes a vocalist who's not that good can convey a lot of feelings.

eg Siobhan has such an emotional way of singing in Violet Indiana

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This song by Metronome is really beautiful too

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But I think emotions in music are not only about sad songs, and these kind of songs have a lot of emotions in a totally different way, the kind of emotions who make you wake up happily and have a good day.

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[tosinn 3]

All of 9GBO's songs are full of emotions. And I'd say some songs by cocklobin too, especially coil.

[Number Girl 48]

A song that I feel is geared towards not just expressing an emotion, but channeling the emotion to the listeners is what I think is part of an effectively "emotional" song. A ballad is just another song if I feel the singer or guitar player is detached from the speaker and just seem to be doing it to have a sad song to add variety to their discography. (Hence why I tend to roll my eyes whenever I hear an artist has another "great" ballad out).

I think subjectivity does play a part in it, but I also believe it can also be a matter of an individual's understanding. Sometimes you can't get all you can out of a song by just hearing it once, by not understanding the lyrics (specifically the Japanese bands), or by just listening to the guitars or some other aspect and not the song as a whole. There are times when I have to look at those various deminisions before I come to really love a song.

I hope that all makes sense. . .

[SUBLIMINAL 52]

You know, I don't think about what makes a song emotional. It can be anything. I'll be listening and I'll have an urge to cry swell in me (or I will simply burst into tears), smile broadly, laugh. It just happens. I might not find the same song emotional twice, I might bawl like a baby every time I listen to it. The music might get under my skin, the lyrics might be insidious, the vocals moving. I could associate a memory with it, it could be what I need to hear at any given moment.

So I agree that it is subjective.

[dracolicious13 1]

oh god..this is like the toughest topic ever.

A part of me really really prefers clean beautiful vocals, but I cannot deny the fact that emotion is important. ( Cause I wouldn't love Dir en grey if I only listened to AMAZING vocals...cause unfortunately Kyo is odd in a sense where he has an AMAZING range, and I'm quoting MY vocal coach here, yet he is so raw and untrained that very likely each time he sings hes slowly and likely painfully destroying his voice.)

I really hate when people confuse screaming and growling for "emotional singing". There are tones of vocalists who sing normally without having to result to any screaming and growling and yet are considered to be very good at expressing emotion.

But I do feel like a lot of jrockers tend to hide behind screaming, using it as a way to "express" emotion, while in singing they sound inexpressive.

As someone already pointed out Satsuki is good at showing emotion while singing. He doesn't need to scream and still his singing expresses every little influx of feeling he has while singing the song. I truly respect him for that.

Mind you I've also noticed that he can't do that with every song ever. There are songs where he has no expression what so ever. Same with Kyo.

And the weird part is, sometimes when you think you are singing expressively, you aren't. Its difficult to convey emotion through song. Its likely sometimes that even they do not entirely connect with the songs they sing.

But in no way do I think emotional singer who sounds like crap is better than someone who worked their ass off to sound FLAWLESS and yet fails at expressing emotion. I think when you DO get a combination of someone who HAS both those aspects do you get a truly talented vocalist/singer.

Heres something weird. ( and yes I'm gonna use him as an example)

Andrea Bocelli ( yes I went there lol) He stars off pretty emotionless. Dunno why. But as the song progresses it becomes amazing. And can you imagine being THERE? Watching it live? I don't usually like opera singers, but I do like him. He has a good voice and is capable of expressing emotion through his voice.

Heres another example of a beautiful voice and fantastic expressiveness.

The interesting part is that recorded this song sounds very BLAND and dead.

But these are not Jrock examples. And they were both Live...which at times gives people an advantage. The atmosphere always helps, especially if you are in the audience watching.

There is something I discovered for myself with recorded music and that if no matter how sad it is, if it does not bring a feeling of some sort of happiness to me, its a dead song. What do I mean by dead song? A dead song is something that can in fact move you, but it physically moves you. The song itself creates the emotion for you, its controlling you. An alive song is the type that when you listen to it, emotion flourishes from inside of you. It doesn't have to be something to do with the songs emotion or lyrics at all, but you feel it inside, whatever feeling it may be. And that emotion inside you starts to control you. I've decided this only recently from taking Aesthetics philosophy course. We were discussing if ART is dead, and if music is dead. I'd say for most part MOST music we hear now is DEAD. Especially all the crap on the radio. At the same time I am not saying all mainstream music is the DEAD music. There are cases where an "alive" song does in fact leak through. Its those very songs that are ALIVE which will go on LIVING long after its composers are dead. I'll give an example of what I think is an ALIVE song and what is I think is a DEAD song, from the same band.

Yes Namamekashiki Ansoku, Tamerai ni Hohoemi by Dir en grey is what I think is an Alive song. If I could express to any of you what this song makes me feel you'd be totally confused. Its a song that makes me feel like I can breathe again. Like the world is not that bad. It doesn't make sense with the lyrics tho at all. Its the music, and the way Kyo sings.

An example of a dead song by Dir en grey is Saku

The song dictates you to be angry. And that anger comes from the outside. Not inside of you. Which works well for when you are in fact angry at something and then you turn this baby up and its ANGER GALORE basically. But if you listen to it while happy or giddy, I find that there is no enjoyment of this song anymore. Namamekashiki Ansoku... I can listen to no matter what mood I am in, and the feeling that comes from inside, will still come. I don't want to use the words "makes me" because it doesn't make me do anything, except feel. Saku makes me THINK I am feeling something, while I am not. Saku controls what I am feeling. Namamekashiki makes me actually FEEL. Its an odd concept I know,but I do not know how else to explain it.

And I'm not saying that ALL BALLADS are the ALIVE songs and all fast paced songs are dead. Thats not the case at all. Any song can be alive if it makes YOU feel alive. Basically.

I went off topic...but maybe somehow this will be relevant..D:

Also that seemed long...sorry guys ><;

[doaseternity6 93]

Simply it's pretty subjective.

Personally I don't find screaming/growling emotional or even expressing real anger, instead I tend to roll my eyes and think "u mad huh?" and skip it, while I think it's much more impressive and I'm much more receptive to feeling anger/pain/sadness in someone singing it out.

Personally I tend to feel more emotion from women vocalist than male, which is why I tend to prefer them but I also know a lot of people who prefer male vocals because they say they showcase emotion (particularly anger, pain etc.) better then women, where as I tend to feel women display much wider forms of emotion.

Personally I'm more likely to feel an emotional connection to melancholic songs, as opposed to straight up ballads which I tend to think like the screaming/growling thing are a bit forced, and I'm also not of the mindset that there isn't any emotion in a song that isn't about iono how terrible the world is and how you can't get out of the darkness or w.e other "sad" cues.

Personally I find Shou to have a lot of emotion when he sings, which is one of the reasons why I love his voice while I'm sure a lot of people hate it, inversely I tend to find that I feel nothing when I hear Ruki sing (which is probably the biggest reason I can't seem to get into much of anything the gazette has been releasing for awhile now) while I think a lot of people do.

Personally I also do find Kyo to be pretty emotional (since he seems to be injected in quite a few posts here I'll take a crack at it too) but in accordance with the first point much more so when he's singing, foe example songs like 24ko cylinders, kasumi... hell even jessica (lol) as opposed to clever sleazoid or pink killer, which I like but don't listen to for any kind of emotional connection (mostly for I love soda, soda!!! and shut up duck purposes >:])

So as I'm pretty sure that doesn't fit everyone else in the world like a glove, It varies from person to person. And thank goodness for that =)

Oh and also as far as vocal technique goes, I think there should be a balance between that and emotion and that one doesn't have to necessarily sacrifice one for the other but often times they do (iono asagi comes to mind for me here, really really try hard but I never actually feel anything), that said if I leaned closer to one or the other it would be the perceived emotion over technique which especially in rock music can be overlooked some I think.

[saishuu 3220]

I think the best songs are the ones that allow the vocalists to not only convey all those feelings/emotions that were already recorded in a studio version, but also allow them to take the emotion to another level in live showcases. The best vocalists for me, obviously, are also the ones who are in fact able to connect with a song this way. The closer someone gets to scream or cry in anger/sadness while singing certain song, the better they are for me. Koshi Inaba from B'z is my favorite example:

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I also tend to agree with doe on most topics, including not finding growling any emotional, having a preference for melancholic songs rather than ballads (even though I like these too most of the time) and disliking vocalists like Ruki who pass absolutely nothing through their voices.

[Guest]

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