Does anyone else find it easy to sing "Saku" by Dir En Grey

[Himeaimichu 1535]

So my thing is primarily vocals, and I work with my high range a lot for multiple reasons, and I commonly find myself turning to Dir En Grey songs for that. I haven't known of the song Saku for a while and it was since last year I learned to actually sing on tune and do vibrato. But now, I find myself perfectly harmonising to the song "Saku", which uses a lot of Kyo's high notes. Obviously, Kyo has gone higher, but "Saku" does demonstrate a lot of his high range. But it has me wondering, is what I'm doing unique, since Kyo literally holds an official record of having one of the highest ranges in all of Metal, or does anyone else find it easy?

I doubt myself about this, mostly because I'm just normally humble, but also because it's only since last year that I was actually able to find a range that I could sing on tune with and use vibrato. I have improved a lot and also find myself singing songs I thought were impossible for me to sing not 6 months ago. 

[lichtlune 915]

Well I'm a baritone male so I really have to strain to hit any high notes like that. I could try but it wouldn't sound very good. lol 

[Himeaimichu 1535]

Just now, lichtlune said:

Well I'm a baritone male so I really have to strain to hit any high notes like that. I could try but it wouldn't sound very good. lol 

IDK how to describe my range. I can go from singing some of D's songs, to singing Saku. I work best with songs done by Kuroyuri To Kage, since I listen to them most and Mei's high notes are quite easy to hit for me. I learned how to hit highs though from Kiryu's "Etsu to Utsu", which took me a few weeks to nail.

It's worth mentioning I'm a transgirl (AKA born a male) with lavender linguistics, so, yeah xD

[Elazmus 1873]

34 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

I could try but it wouldn't sound very good. lol

IMHO Kyo's whole singing style comes from having this^ thought and then throwing that thought out the window XD

[Himeaimichu 1535]

Just now, Elazmus said:

IMHO Kyo's whole singing style comes from having this^ thought and then throwing that thought out the window XD

Yeah. In my opinion, I think anyone of any biology, with enough practice, can hit pretty high notes. I mean, I've seen some people hit quite good high notes on tune, who normally have gruffy, or deep voices. I've heard some pretty sweet sounding vocals come from people you wouldn't expect to hear them from. For example, the lead singer of AFI looks pretty masculine now that he has facial hair, but can still hit those feminine notes in songs such as "Girl's not Grey". Of course, he's not known for having a deep voice though xD. 

Of course though, Kyo is also not known for having a deep voice either, so high notes are to be expected of him too. I think speaking voice also can tell what kind of range someone has. My speaking ranges from sounding pretty deep, to sounding genderless, to sounding falsetto (I swear it's not because of hormones xD. It's just the way I am xD) and half the time, I'm not even trying xD.

The key to hitting high notes in general (no pun intended) is falsetto. I mean, of course you'll sound weird at first, but practice makes perfect. The way I learned to sing high notes was through falsetto. And not only can I hit those notes, but according to my friends, I sound pretty feminine too. (Which is totally what I'm going for xD)

[Himeaimichu 1535]

It's also worth mentioning unlike Kyo, I haven't had numerous vocal surgeries, growl incorrectly, or had an alcohol and cigarette addiction, so while it's apparently hard for Kyo to hit highs, it's quite easy for me. Though, no live performance ever does Kyo any justice. In the 90's, he sang through his throat, and didn't go into the high range a lot. In the modern era, he holds the mic incorrectly, making him sound derpy, despite now being able to sing properly. 

Of course, I never had any proper vocal training (Though I'd love to have some) so I don't even know if I'm personally singing correctly. 

One day, I'll record myself for you all to judge yourselves. It's too late at night right now, but if I remember, I'll do it tomorrow

[Kaleidoscope 195]

13 hours ago, Elazmus said:

IMHO Kyo's whole singing style comes from having this^ thought and then throwing that thought out the window XD

100% this. Kyo is a singer who has always used techniques before had learned to control them. I personally like this approach and follow it myself, but it is sometimes risky and often shows at live performances if you do songs that you can only sing in the studio.

 

As to your issue, I went throught really similar thought processes too when I started with singing - thinking that my range and voice might be extraordinary, talking about it a lot and feeling the need to express it. And I think it's not necessarily a bad thing  Especially when you just started out singing, it is important to have some confidence and believe in your abilities. However, a tip I can definitely give you is to look critically at your vocals and not lose sight of all the flaws you have - and I assure you, just as I still have them, you have them too. Without a teacher, it's actually fairly hard to notice them if your ear is not yet trained and accustomed to what your voice does, so it definitely helps to get some professional feedback on your singing!

 

To answer your initial question: Yes, it is easy for trained tenors who have the basics of belting (basically powerful singing if you are not familiar with the term) down to hit most of the notes in Saku, it's not exceptionally high except for that high part towards the end of the song. In general, as you said, pretty much everybody can theoretically learn to hit high notes with certain techniques, but it will sound different depending on your voice type. I have a fairly low voice and my voice gets a fairly piercing and thin sound when I go really high - the trick is to use your head voice and mixed voice for the very high notes (not falsetto, every guy has that by default and it's usually weak and disconnected). From my experience, I'd say that it's actually harder to learn to hit super low notes (like actual low notes, Asagi from D doesn't sing very low most of the time, he just has a dark timbre). I can sing around Kyo's highest notes (you can hear it from 1:16 onwards in my example, sorry, it's a fairly old cover since I don't have any recent high ones), but I cannot keep up with his super low notes even though I'm a baritone.

 

Turns out I wrote a whole essay, but I hope it helps! Good luck and have fun practicing

 

Edited December 14, 2016 by Kaleidoscope

[Himeaimichu 1535]

2 hours ago, Kaleidoscope said:

100% this. Kyo is a singer who has always used techniques before had learned to control them. I personally like this approach and follow it myself, but it is sometimes risky and often shows at live performances if you do songs that you can only sing in the studio.

 

As to your issue, I went throught really similar thought processes too when I started with singing - thinking that my range and voice might be extraordinary, talking about it a lot and feeling the need to express it. And I think it's not necessarily a bad thing  Especially when you just started out singing, it is important to have some confidence and believe in your abilities. However, a tip I can definitely give you is to look critically at your vocals and not lose sight of all the flaws you have - and I assure you, just as I still have them, you have them too. Without a teacher, it's actually fairly hard to notice them if your ear is not yet trained and accustomed to what your voice does, so it definitely helps to get some professional feedback on your singing!

 

To answer your initial question: Yes, it is easy for trained tenors who have the basics of belting (basically powerful singing if you are not familiar with the term) down to hit most of the notes in Saku, it's not exceptionally high except for that high part towards the end of the song. In general, as you said, pretty much everybody can theoretically learn to hit high notes with certain techniques, but it will sound different depending on your voice type. I have a fairly low voice and my voice gets a fairly piercing and thin sound when I go really high - the trick is to use your head voice and mixed voice for the very high notes (not falsetto, every guy has that by default and it's usually weak and disconnected). From my experience, I'd say that it's actually harder to learn to hit super low notes (like actual low notes, Asagi from D doesn't sing very low most of the time, he just has a dark timbre). I can sing around Kyo's highest notes (you can hear it from 1:16 onwards in my example, sorry, it's a fairly old cover since I don't have any recent high ones), but I cannot keep up with his super low notes even though I'm a baritone.

 

Turns out I wrote a whole essay, but I hope it helps! Good luck and have fun practicing

 

This is probably the most helpful thing I've seen all day~. Thanks so much!

I really do wish to get a teacher someday to help me reach my full potential. The way I try to notice my flaws is I record myself and I see what I need to improve on. I also try to research the techniques as much as possible, and learn different techniques that even if I may not use, will still really help me. Like, for example, I learned Tuvan Throat singing because I knew it would help me learn to scream and growl correctly (Also I happened to go through a small phase where I had an interest in Mongolian and Tuvan music xD)

I can actually hit the high notes of Saku without falsetto, but I prefer to use it since it makes me sound more feminine, though I can also hit a pretty lavender sounding tone without falsetto, but it involves me singing similar to how Karma from AvelCain sings, and I don't think I should try to sing like him, since I'm not completely sure whether he sings correctly. 

[Kaleidoscope 195]

Glad if I was of any help! Yup, that sounds like the right approach It's always good to analyze one's recordings (even though it becomes bothersome if you start regretting uploading something after you find more and more flaws ahaha), sometimes it also helps to look at your notes in a program like Melodyne, for me it helped to see where I usually go flat or sharp!

Ah yeah, with the throat singing you probably mean the false chord stuff, lots of singers use it for growling - I find it rather uncomfortable and prefer to use fry screams (there's lots of tutorials for that on YT, it's pretty cool because you can transition to raspy and clean singing very quickly with it), but it sounds pretty brutal if you can master it.

 

I haven't listened to AvelCain that much, but from what I remember he sounded fine. I think it's good to pick up bits from all singers you come across and like, there is always something you can learn even from singers who are technically not that good

[shiroihana 182]

On 12/13/2016 at 10:39 PM, AimiGen7 said:

IDK how to describe my range. I can go from singing some of D's songs, to singing Saku. I work best with songs done by Kuroyuri To Kage, since I listen to them most and Mei's high notes are quite easy to hit for me. I learned how to hit highs though from Kiryu's "Etsu to Utsu", which took me a few weeks to nail.

It's worth mentioning I'm a transgirl (AKA born a male) with lavender linguistics, so, yeah xD

You sound like you have a lot of range and I'd love to hear you sing!

 

Anyways I think Kyo's head /mixed voice is the most impressive thing about him other than I guess his much improved growling technique over the years. For someone like me to pull of Saku it'd be purely from intensity and I'd have to be incredibly lucky just to even pull it off without going off key or my voice cracking. I'm pretty sure my vocal range is only 2 octaves since I haven't sung scales or w/e to help improve my range so for someone like me or any average singer Saku is definitely a very difficult song to sing. Kyo's a guy who tries out new things regularly, and sometimes he will down right sound silly because of it, but that's what happens when you have the amount of passion and love for music Kyo has - he's an innovator through and through. I remember the early years where he would never have attempted a quarter of the things he has done half a decade later in his career, so pretty cool beans.

Edited January 8, 2017 by shiroihana

[Himeaimichu 1535]

1 hour ago, shiroihana said:

You sound like you have a lot of range and I'd love to hear you sing!

 

Anyways I think Kyo's head /mixed voice is the most impressive thing about him other than I guess his much improved growling technique over the years. For someone like me to pull of Saku it'd be purely from intensity and I'd have to be incredibly lucky just to even pull it off without going off key or my voice cracking. I'm pretty sure my vocal range is only 2 octaves since I haven't sung scales or w/e to help improve my range so for someone like me or any average singer Saku is definitely a very difficult song to sing. Kyo's a guy who tries out new things regularly, and sometimes he will down right sound silly because of it, but that's what happens when you have the amount of passion and love for music Kyo has - he's an innovator through and through. I remember the early years where he would never have attempted a quarter of the things he has done half a decade later in his career, so pretty cool beans.

I'm preparing to one day video me singing and post it here. I'm possibly gonna do "R-18" by GossiP, since I know all the lyrics to that (Usually, I improvise the lyrics XD)

[shiroihana 182]

3 minutes ago, AimiGen7 said:

I'm preparing to one day video me singing and post it here. I'm possibly gonna do "R-18" by GossiP, since I know all the lyrics to that (Usually, I improvise the lyrics XD)

Can't wait! Make sure to let me know!

[Luceillia 8]

Saku would be hard for me to sing since i am more comfortable in the lower ranges but it sure would be a fun cover to try lol